OTT-LAK

[Former Sens]

TO

D John Moore DFD 83 $2,500,000 UFA 2018 (24)

LW Maxim Kitsyn SNP 82 $1,250,000 UFA 2019 (23)

2nd LAK 2017

TO

D Zdeno Chara TWD 87 6.9M UFA 2018 (38)

D Jyrki Jokipakka TWD 84 $1,600,000 UFA 2019 (24)



Accept, another cap shedding trade for me

[sensrule19]

Accept. Excited for a Doughty/Chara top pair

[luongod]

accept

[Vancouver Canucks GM]

Crap. I would've paid about similar for Chara. Neat.

Accepted.

[Former Bad News]

I am really, really iffy with the trade. If it didn't have Jokipakka, I'd accept this.

I'll abstain this for now, because I see too much upside for LA, despite Chara only being a 1 or 2 year guy.

[Deleted]

Ya I agree with Preds there. I'm gonna reject this.

[leaffan92]

May 3, 2015 19:08:15 GMT -8 @kadri43 said:

Ya I agree with Preds there. I'm gonna reject this.

Nothing gets by this guy

[sensrule19]

I kinda see Moore/Jokkipaka as a wash, then it's a young sniper in Kitsyn, a 2nd round pick, and 4.5m ish in cap space for Old Man Chara. Even if you don't think Moore/Joki is fair you just split the pick and it's still Kitsyn, 3rd, Cap Space for Chara who could be an overpriced 84/85 next year.

[Former Bad News]

But the fact still remains that Chara, as of right now, is someone's #2 defenseman on a team. Despite him being 38, he's still got more value than I think you're giving up, and he is actually a defensive beast in the game. Again, if Jokkipaka is removed in the deal, I'll accept it. Otherwise, I can't see any upside for Ottawa other than a small boost in his winger depth. He's losing his #1 defenseman and downgrading on a 2nd pairing defenseman.

[Former Sens]

bump

[Washington Capitals GM]

Mo0re and Jokipakka arent even quite a wash. LA wins that too. Kitsyn and a second arent enough for Chara in my oppinion. hes still a 87, and 82s are meh, even if they are young. That with LA winning the other part as well is the reason that I gotta say reject here. Sorry boys.

[luongod]

rejected final then

[Vancouver Canucks GM]

You guys are nuts... lol This trade was just fine considering Chara's age, cap, overall and likely downgrade before his contract is up; if not, then retirement. Any other player like Jumbo, etc. would have been accepted in a heartbeat... but because it's Chara, you balk at it? I call bullshit, on the highest level, on this one fellas. Pull your heads out of your collective asses FFS.

[Former Bad News]

May 4, 2015 21:03:50 GMT -8 Vancouver Canucks GM said:

You guys are nuts... lol This trade was just fine considering Chara's age, cap, overall and likely downgrade before his contract is up; if not, then retirement. Any other player like Jumbo, etc. would have been accepted in a heartbeat... but because it's Chara, you balk at it? I call bullshit, on the highest level, on this one fellas. Pull your heads out of your collective asses FFS.

Think about it for a second.

May 3, 2015 19:35:08 GMT -8 Former Bad News said:

But the fact still remains that Chara, as of right now, is someone's #2 defenseman on a team.

Top pairing defensemen are, and always should be, very difficult to move. Unless there is going to be someone who immediately replaces that top pairing defenseman on the depth chart, the trade should not happen. Sure, he's 38. Sure, he's got a salary cap of 6.9 million. Sure, he's most likely going to see either a -1 or -2 (depending on his production) after this following season. HOWEVER, there are so many things that make this trade unfair to Ottawa. First off, like I said before, Ottawa is losing a top pairing defenseman. That should point out some red flags already. Second, look at what the return really is for Chara. Given the fact that people see the Moore/Jokipakka swap as fair (even though it really isn't), Zdeno Chara is being traded for Kitsyn (who will probably be placed on the 3rd line), and a draft booster for next season. How can youu see that, in any way, as a fair trade?

We are looking at a trade that bolsters LA's defense, giving them a top pairing defenseman, and a quality 2nd pairing defenseman for a 3rd liner, a downgrade on the 2nd pair, and a booster for next season, which determining Ottawa's season this following year could mean either a trade bait booster (let's face it, playoff teams don't usually keep their picks, so the boosters are easy to trade for them) or a +2 to a rookie. That means the booster is either worthless or valuable. We don't know. Make it a 2016 2nd, and I'll sway a little more to fair. Still not quite there though.

There needs to be more value coming back to Ottawa, period. A Chara priceline should be someone who is in the same part of their career as Chara who could immediately fill in for either the top defensive pair or the top 6 forward line, OR a promising defender/forward who is borderline 2nd/3rd line talent that has the chance of becoming a top line player within 2 or 3 seasons. Kitsyn is not that promising forward (see pre-upgrades Cotourier, Sandheim, etc). I may be determining ratings here, but I'm also determining the future of both franchises, and this trade will, in my opinion, make Ottawa worse off than LA after 2 or 3 seasons.

[sensrule19]

May 4, 2015 22:19:58 GMT -8 Former Bad News said:

May 4, 2015 21:03:50 GMT -8 Vancouver Canucks GM said:

You guys are nuts... lol This trade was just fine considering Chara's age, cap, overall and likely downgrade before his contract is up; if not, then retirement. Any other player like Jumbo, etc. would have been accepted in a heartbeat... but because it's Chara, you balk at it? I call bullshit, on the highest level, on this one fellas. Pull your heads out of your collective asses FFS.

Think about it for a second.

May 3, 2015 19:35:08 GMT -8 Former Bad News said:

But the fact still remains that Chara, as of right now, is someone's #2 defenseman on a team.

Top pairing defensemen are, and always should be, very difficult to move. Unless there is going to be someone who immediately replaces that top pairing defenseman on the depth chart, the trade should not happen. Sure, he's 38. Sure, he's got a salary cap of 6.9 million. Sure, he's most likely going to see either a -1 or -2 (depending on his production) after this following season. HOWEVER, there are so many things that make this trade unfair to Ottawa. First off, like I said before, Ottawa is losing a top pairing defenseman. That should point out some red flags already. Second, look at what the return really is for Chara. Given the fact that people see the Moore/Jokipakka swap as fair (even though it really isn't), Zdeno Chara is being traded for Kitsyn (who will probably be placed on the 3rd line), and a draft booster for next season. How can youu see that, in any way, as a fair trade?

We are looking at a trade that bolsters LA's defense, giving them a top pairing defenseman, and a quality 2nd pairing defenseman for a 3rd liner, a downgrade on the 2nd pair, and a booster for next season, which determining Ottawa's season this following year could mean either a trade bait booster (let's face it, playoff teams don't usually keep their picks, so the boosters are easy to trade for them) or a +2 to a rookie. That means the booster is either worthless or valuable. We don't know. Make it a 2016 2nd, and I'll sway a little more to fair. Still not quite there though.

There needs to be more value coming back to Ottawa, period. A Chara priceline should be someone who is in the same part of their career as Chara who could immediately fill in for either the top defensive pair or the top 6 forward line, OR a promising defender/forward who is borderline 2nd/3rd line talent that has the chance of becoming a top line player within 2 or 3 seasons. Kitsyn is not that promising forward (see pre-upgrades Cotourier, Sandheim, etc). I may be determining ratings here, but I'm also determining the future of both franchises, and this trade will, in my opinion, make Ottawa worse off than LA after 2 or 3 seasons.

So you can trade a 24 year old 78 overall for 85 overall 31 year old Grabovski and it's fair, but I give a decent package for Chara and it some how makes Ottawa worse both now and after Chara retires? And he dumps more cap in this deal than yours? I don't get it. It's already rejected/finalized but I'm not really willing to add much more because I think this is a more than fair return after seeing the Grabovski trade. Hell after that trade I feel like I'm over paying big time.

[Vancouver Canucks GM]

May 4, 2015 22:19:58 GMT -8 Former Bad News said:

May 4, 2015 21:03:50 GMT -8 Vancouver Canucks GM said:

You guys are nuts... lol This trade was just fine considering Chara's age, cap, overall and likely downgrade before his contract is up; if not, then retirement. Any other player like Jumbo, etc. would have been accepted in a heartbeat... but because it's Chara, you balk at it? I call bullshit, on the highest level, on this one fellas. Pull your heads out of your collective asses FFS.

Think about it for a second.

May 3, 2015 19:35:08 GMT -8 Former Bad News said:

But the fact still remains that Chara, as of right now, is someone's #2 defenseman on a team.

Top pairing defensemen are, and always should be, very difficult to move. Unless there is going to be someone who immediately replaces that top pairing defenseman on the depth chart, the trade should not happen. Sure, he's 38. Sure, he's got a salary cap of 6.9 million. Sure, he's most likely going to see either a -1 or -2 (depending on his production) after this following season. HOWEVER, there are so many things that make this trade unfair to Ottawa. First off, like I said before, Ottawa is losing a top pairing defenseman. That should point out some red flags already. Second, look at what the return really is for Chara. Given the fact that people see the Moore/Jokipakka swap as fair (even though it really isn't), Zdeno Chara is being traded for Kitsyn (who will probably be placed on the 3rd line), and a draft booster for next season. How can youu see that, in any way, as a fair trade?

We are looking at a trade that bolsters LA's defense, giving them a top pairing defenseman, and a quality 2nd pairing defenseman for a 3rd liner, a downgrade on the 2nd pair, and a booster for next season, which determining Ottawa's season this following year could mean either a trade bait booster (let's face it, playoff teams don't usually keep their picks, so the boosters are easy to trade for them) or a +2 to a rookie. That means the booster is either worthless or valuable. We don't know. Make it a 2016 2nd, and I'll sway a little more to fair. Still not quite there though.

There needs to be more value coming back to Ottawa, period. A Chara priceline should be someone who is in the same part of their career as Chara who could immediately fill in for either the top defensive pair or the top 6 forward line, OR a promising defender/forward who is borderline 2nd/3rd line talent that has the chance of becoming a top line player within 2 or 3 seasons. Kitsyn is not that promising forward (see pre-upgrades Cotourier, Sandheim, etc). I may be determining ratings here, but I'm also determining the future of both franchises, and this trade will, in my opinion, make Ottawa worse off than LA after 2 or 3 seasons.

I completely disagree with you. Suddenly a 38 yr old player now has more value because his name is Chara, yet guys like Marleau, Thornton, Bergeron, they get older and downgraded, as much if not more than Chara has already, but they have no value? As trade mods, it's not our job to sit here and micro manage other GMs teams and figure out who's going to play on what line or what pairing. Do you even realize how difficult it is to trade any 38 yr old player in this league for ANY value at all? It doesn't matter if it's Chara or anyone else, Ottawa's looking ahead to the future in trading off Chara now while he can still get some value for him. What's wrong with that? Cuz when you approach anyone about any deal, the very first fucking things anyone I've ever dealt with looks at is Age & Cap hit... and 9 times out of 10, if players are barely over even 30, the standard answer is: "Oh, I don't want old players." or "Nah, he's getting downgraded next season, so he's not worth trading for." and so on.

It's also not like Former Sens is some fucking noob to these leagues either man. LA's looking for some immediacy in acquiring Chara, and Ottawa is looking to shed cap and get younger. It's a win/win senario as far as I'm concerned.